So, someone on a friend’s blog (I think) mentioned that they thought the reason that so many vitriolic homophobes are gay is that it’s because they feel an inner conflict, and thus, feel like everyone else must feel that inner conflict, as well. I realize that it’s probably patently obvious to most people, but that really made me think about the whole situation in a new way.
Just to put things into context, I have a number of gay friends. Had gay housemates in college. I have absolutely no qualms with gayness, gay people, or the acts involved when one is gay. However, I’m not gay myself, and haven’t ever even really been particularly curious to explore.
But that’s the thing – I’ve been exposed to the *option* of gayness, and pretty quickly thought, you know, that’s not for me. But, this really got me to thinking – I often map my own desires, motivations, view of the world onto other people. Makes it sometimes difficult to understand why someone might say, be racist. Just seems weird to me, since I’m mixed race, I never even really had say, a mental option of saying that one race is superior to another. How the hell would I know? So I have a hard time really truly understanding what a racist person really thinks. It’s just a foreign thought process.
Similarly, I can’t really imagine a thought process that involves denouncing homosexuals, as though it’s a genuinely serious problems. See, I can imagine say, at the time, thinking that Nazis were a big problem. That something should be done about that, since it’s actually a pretty pressing issue. But homosexuality is even in the top 10 these days, with all that’s going on in the world? Who thinks like that?
And so it occurred to me, after reading this thought, wherever it was, that yes, that sounds right. Someone who thinks, in these times, that gayness is somehow on par with the Middle East, or the corruption in our government, or the growing class division, or the economy as a whole, or how lame mainstream music has become, or frankly, anything, is something I have a hard time wrapping my head around, because it’s not something I’m confronted with every day. It’s not something I wake up and think about on a personal level, any more than I wake up in the morning and think that I’m half-Asian. Doesn’t occur to me.
But it *does* occur to some people. They wake up in the morning, and think to themselves, “I hate fags. God hates fags,” and then they think that it’s important enough that they have to go prosletyze to the rest of the world, that they should all hate fags too. These are people who have some sort of internal struggle with the concept, every day. They think about sexuality, and they see the presence of gays as a threat to them.
Let’s just toss out the Biblical verses some of these chumps use to support their cause, ’cause even if you believe in that stuff, there’s a whole lot in there that’s more condemned than gayness. Like, say, war, or murder, or theivery, or adultery, or divorce, or any number of other things. So, even if you believe in it, gayness ain’t the main problem you should really be rallying against, if you’re genuinely going in order of priority.
Why would a gay person be a threat to someone, in this modern age? When, frankly, was the last time that you saw a gay couple openly doing something that felt or seemed like a threat to you? Pride, maybe, if you’re really easily threatened? But if you find that a threat, doesn’t that imply that you’re susceptible to the *potential* to suddenly, out of nowhere, get all queered up?
To me, that’s ludicrous. Seeing a bunch of men in chaps doesn’t change my lack of desire to fall in love with another man. Just doesn’t. So, yeah. That’s the only point, really. If you feel like somehow, the presence of gays is a threat to you, the *only* reasonable reason is simply that you’re gay, and you don’t want to admit it, because maybe you were brought up to think it was wrong. Get over it, but deal with it yourself. Stop fucking up other people’s lives, ’cause you’re ashamed of who you are.
And yes, Mr. Santorum, I’m looking at you.
I don’t know what is wrong with me but for some reason, “six seven six” and “incite a riot” just don’t “stick” in my mind with who writes them. I made it to “Just seems weird to me, since I’m mixed race” and thought, “eingy is mixed?”
What does “six seven six” mean anyway?
That was the point I was trying to make in my last post, and once again, you spelled it out better than I could have.
It’s like; I *almost* wonder if opponents of gay marriage realize that if it becomes legal, they won’t be forced to marry someone of the same sex. Of course they don’t think that’s going to happen, so what’s the big deal? Why are they so pissed off? Either they’re gay and feel guilty about it, or they’re gay and jealous. Nothing else makes sense.
You can totally tell when it’s Seppo because he uses a lot of “*” markers. 😀
Re: six seven six. Seppo likes to give away too much identifying information on the interwebs. I’m not gonna say.
Speaking of giving away too much info, Seppo has a friend on his XBox Live friends list who uses “ss” + his whole damn social security number!!!! It makes me want to stab out my eyes. Or his eyes.
It’s weird that you didn’t remember that it was Chad’s blog you saw it on, even after quoting kerowack’s comment on that very blog entry.
I knew about the topic on Chad’s blog, but didn’t realize it was from a comment there. I worried it was one of those weird “crossover +1” comments, so I didn’t bother tracking it down.
ei-nyung: you have GOT to be kidding about ss, right? Please?
No. And actually, I think he might make it EVEN MORE clear by using “ssn” rather than “ss” as I had mistakenly written earlier.
It’s insane, naive, and invites problems into all areas of his life. And yet, this dude does it. Seppo has already tried speak to him, but to no avail.
I use Seppo’s SSN for one of my Live accounts. I hope that’s not a problem.
Now that’s just crazy. I can’t imagine letting people know even, say, my full name, on the internet. You can’t trust people online.
Yeah. Or like your birth year.
I suspect some homophobes hate gays and lesbians because they have an inner conflict, but I also believe that there are a lot of mean people who just love being mean for any reason.
I also think there is a great deal of peer pressure for white males from various hick centers in the Southern and Central quadrants of our country to assert their manliness vis a vis: drinking beer, killing deer, bashing gays, eating grits, growing a punk ass moustache, fucking your girlfriend at the county fair, going to Church.
In short, some homophobes are mean sheep.
There’s a radio show in NY and I don’t know who hosts it, but they were talking about Brokeback Mountain and one of the lackeys on the show said, “I’d go see it, but I’d be afraid that I’d walk out and some guy would be palming my butt.”
Because after seeing that movie (amazing BTW) the first thing I wanted to do was pinch male ass.
I also think there is a great deal of peer pressure for white males from various hick centers in the Southern and Central quadrants of our country to assert their manliness vis a vis: drinking beer, killing deer, bashing gays, eating grits, growing a punk ass moustache, fucking your girlfriend at the county fair, going to Church.
This describes the backwoods town my Dad moved us to at the end of my high school years.
I had a huge conversation with my dad about this (right before I stopped speaking to him altogether). I asked him what was so wrong with gay people and the only thing he could come up with was some smart ass retort about “up the butt.” Right. Because straight people don’t do that either.
Useless people irk me.
– Becky
You hear the “homophobes are latent homosexuals” thing all the time, and I think it’s total bullshit. For one thing, that would mean that at least half the US and most of the Middle East are at least bisexuals, and that’s obviously not true. And for another, it’s too simple and convenient and ironic an answer.
It’s really just that people naturally group and classify themselves and each other into Us vs. Them. If it’s not fags vs. breeders or blacks vs. Koreans or Jews vs. Arabs or Chinese vs. Japanese, it’s San Francisco vs. “Middle America”. It’s important to a lot of people’s self-worth: it’s harder to explain why you’re worthwhile just on your own merits, but it’s a lot easier to just point to someone else and say, “I’m not like them.”
With the gay thing, it’s because the cultures who usually have the most violent anti-homosexual cultures are the ones who put the most value on What It Means To Be A Man. And if you’ve got any doubts as to whether you’re a Good Man, the easiest way is to point out how you’re not in any way feminine.
The whole “homophobes are latent homos themselves” thing bugs me because it doesn’t do any good. It’s too easily proven wrong.
In the end it doesn’t make much difference, because Santorum is still a miserable little shitstain, but it’d be nice to be able to explain exactly how and why he’s a miserable little shitstain instead of just calling him a faggot in denial.
I don’t mean to say that *all* homophobes are latent homosexuals – not by any stretch. And it’s true, someone like Santorum is most likely “playing to his audience” – that is, he’s chosen to further the agenda of rabid right-wing evangelical kooks, and so his views have to mirror theirs.
I think the point I was trying to get at is why there are so many vehemently anti-gay “crusaders” who end up being so hypocritical on the subject. And to that end, the notion was, that it’s because they’re spending a lot of time thinking about it, and if they think it’s a struggle for themselves, they must think it’s a struggle for everyone else, as well.
But no, I think there are also craploads of other cultural institutions that promote homophobic attitudes, and such, and that undoubtedly outweighs the few cases where it’s a person struggling with their inner selves.
…instead of just calling him a faggot in denial.
There is a subtle difference between that and what is being said on this blog. What’s being argued or posited is not how easy it is to insult someone who is anti-gay by calling them gay, because the position is NOT that being gay is an insult.
So while I understand what you are saying, the wrap-up of that comment really doesn’t apply to the position at hand and gives it a completely different, opposing slant.
ei-nyung: yeah, on re-reading that came across a lot more caustic than I’d intended. Plus out of context (I’m gay) it could sound like I’m a lot more homophobic than I really am. My point’s the same, it was just badly worded.
And yeah, part of what bugs me about it is that it often just boils down to somebody still using gay as an insult. Even if it’s a well-intentioned one.
seppo: I guess the main part of my point is that yeah, for someone to make it such an anti-gay crusade they are going through some kind of struggle. I’m just HIGHLY skeptical that it’s a struggle with their own sexuality — that’s definitely not always the case, but I’d say it’s not even OFTEN. The reports of highly-vocal anti-gay speakers getting busted soliciting gay sex get a lot of press because they’re inherently news-friendly and attention-grabbing, but they’re not that common.
I’m just saying that I think the struggle is against a lot more than just their own sexuality. It’s the expectations of self-worth and the general attitude of everyone that being homosexual is very different. But like you say: it should just be a non-issue. Now that I can finally recognize that, I wish everybody could see that it’s not that weird or shocking or threatening, and in fact it’s not even all that interesting.
Word.
seppo